I will admit, I have not read the source theory, but I engage often with communists (most of my immidiate sphere are communists) enough to get a lot of it (I am actually an Anarcho-Communist, just to note). But my problem, as always, with a lot of you people who are obsessed with trying to use China as an example of communism, is the fact that theory and practice are two very different things. Very few places if any even follow your own theory from what I have gleaned from other comrades.
It is also really easy to pressure people to give the answers you want to for those kind of questions if you are an authoritarian state. Also from the cyber security sector, most citizens of China desperately try and get their hands on vpns or use tor in order to be able to actually access the external world, which is never a good sign and does not scream “We’re free!” to me.
Also fox news is abhorant, as is all American backed official news outlets. I use lemmy, did you really think that I watch state provided news? Or was that an ad hominim because people here dislike Fox specifically?
Marxist-Leninist theory and practice are united in the PRC. As you admit, you have not read much theory, and are commiting the same error as the person you linked: a non-Marxist judging a socialist state in the primary stage by the characteristics applicable to an advanced communist society. I linked you some good starting points so you can correct these misunderstandings, but if you are going to continue to insist on being right about theory you admitted you haven’t even read, then there isn’t much room for constructive discussion.
As for the dismissal of consistent hard data on the grounds that Chinese citizens are “pressured,” this data is from western orgs surveying Chinese citizens, unaffiliated with the CPC. Western orgs have been trying to understand CPC resilliance because they wish to undermine it, and as such have been trying to best understand why the CPC is beloved. Spoiler: it’s socialism.
The Fox News bit was a tongue-in-cheek jab referencing the fact that you are repeating right-wing talking points about the PRC near-identical to mainstream media. I apologize for the jab, but I consider it fair after you opened with jabs and condescension yourself.
A bit on the “stages of socialism” I referenced, a table from Cheng Enfu:
I appreciate the apology for the jab and i as well apologize for seeming somewhat resistant and bitter. Most of my problem with china comes from how they handle the digital front and has kind of left a bad taste in my mouth for how they treat their citizens, so it’s really hard for me to imagine they’re doing socialism correctly. I will probably go and look into the sources you linked.
For the PRC, specifically with respect to the “Great Firewall,” it’s largely a two-fold measure.
It forces internal internet development, rather than relying on the present system flooded by western capital. This forces self-reliance.
The west has huge amounts of money and a near total control on information, and has historically used it in “Radio Free X” news stations to propagandize against and undermine socialism in the real world. It keeps control out of the hands of capitalists in the PRC, which is critical in a country where class struggle is very much alive and constant.
The people use VPNs if they want to, it isn’t very strictly enforced against. Ultimately, what’s important is that, in the information age, China has sovereignty over its own infrastructure and the working class is in charge. This is directly shown in huge approval rates, and rapid development from democratically decided Five Year Plans. China has taken a scientific approach to production and development, and while they have a long way to go, they’ve come farther than anyone else in far shorter of an amount of time.
I’m not saying you have to abandon anarcho-communism (though I once was an anarchist myself), I just encourage you to take a sympathetic approach rather than an antagonistic one when trying to understand the system the people of China have fought and died for, and work day in and day out with pride to continue building up.
I will admit, I have not read the source theory, but I engage often with communists (most of my immidiate sphere are communists) enough to get a lot of it (I am actually an Anarcho-Communist, just to note). But my problem, as always, with a lot of you people who are obsessed with trying to use China as an example of communism, is the fact that theory and practice are two very different things. Very few places if any even follow your own theory from what I have gleaned from other comrades.
It is also really easy to pressure people to give the answers you want to for those kind of questions if you are an authoritarian state. Also from the cyber security sector, most citizens of China desperately try and get their hands on vpns or use tor in order to be able to actually access the external world, which is never a good sign and does not scream “We’re free!” to me.
Also fox news is abhorant, as is all American backed official news outlets. I use lemmy, did you really think that I watch state provided news? Or was that an ad hominim because people here dislike Fox specifically?
Trust me, we knew.
Marxist-Leninist theory and practice are united in the PRC. As you admit, you have not read much theory, and are commiting the same error as the person you linked: a non-Marxist judging a socialist state in the primary stage by the characteristics applicable to an advanced communist society. I linked you some good starting points so you can correct these misunderstandings, but if you are going to continue to insist on being right about theory you admitted you haven’t even read, then there isn’t much room for constructive discussion.
As for the dismissal of consistent hard data on the grounds that Chinese citizens are “pressured,” this data is from western orgs surveying Chinese citizens, unaffiliated with the CPC. Western orgs have been trying to understand CPC resilliance because they wish to undermine it, and as such have been trying to best understand why the CPC is beloved. Spoiler: it’s socialism.
The Fox News bit was a tongue-in-cheek jab referencing the fact that you are repeating right-wing talking points about the PRC near-identical to mainstream media. I apologize for the jab, but I consider it fair after you opened with jabs and condescension yourself.
A bit on the “stages of socialism” I referenced, a table from Cheng Enfu:
I appreciate the apology for the jab and i as well apologize for seeming somewhat resistant and bitter. Most of my problem with china comes from how they handle the digital front and has kind of left a bad taste in my mouth for how they treat their citizens, so it’s really hard for me to imagine they’re doing socialism correctly. I will probably go and look into the sources you linked.
Apology accepted!
For the PRC, specifically with respect to the “Great Firewall,” it’s largely a two-fold measure.
It forces internal internet development, rather than relying on the present system flooded by western capital. This forces self-reliance.
The west has huge amounts of money and a near total control on information, and has historically used it in “Radio Free X” news stations to propagandize against and undermine socialism in the real world. It keeps control out of the hands of capitalists in the PRC, which is critical in a country where class struggle is very much alive and constant.
The people use VPNs if they want to, it isn’t very strictly enforced against. Ultimately, what’s important is that, in the information age, China has sovereignty over its own infrastructure and the working class is in charge. This is directly shown in huge approval rates, and rapid development from democratically decided Five Year Plans. China has taken a scientific approach to production and development, and while they have a long way to go, they’ve come farther than anyone else in far shorter of an amount of time.
I’m not saying you have to abandon anarcho-communism (though I once was an anarchist myself), I just encourage you to take a sympathetic approach rather than an antagonistic one when trying to understand the system the people of China have fought and died for, and work day in and day out with pride to continue building up.