pacman -r weight-lossWhich can only be a good thing.
All these weight loss drugs remind me of methadone.
I was a care coordinator and methadone dispenser for 15 years.
Methadone, was developed by the Nazi’s in WW2 because the alies managed to prevent the importation of Morphine into Germany. The Nazi’s had no choice but to developed the synthetic drug Methadone to replace Morphine on the battlefield.
When a person is addicted to heroin and wants to quit. He has two choices, a maintenance prescription or a reduction prescription.
The idea of the maintenance prescription is to maintain the addiction by giving the user enough methadone so he does not experience withdrawal symptom and can engage in life without constantly getting involved in crime and unsafe practices by using and buying heroin. If the user stops taking his methadone prescription he will have to start using heroin again to prevent withdrawal symptoms.
The idea of the reduction prescription, is to slowly reduce the amount of methadone down to zero, over a period of time, so the user can be clean and free of heroin.
Weight loss drugs are like a methadone maintenance prescription.
In that it may reduce the overall weight of the person for short period, but ultimately the person is still reliant on the weight loss drug to reach their goals. This is an addiction.
Addiction is a neuropsychological disorder characterized by a persistent and intense urge (to lose weight) to use a drug or engage in a behavior that produces natural reward (weight loss) despite substantial harm and other negative consequences.
Like heroin addicts stopping methadone and returning to heroin, those who are overweight will put on weigh as soon as the weight loss drug is stopped. So there is a great need to continue with the addictive drug.
Just like the cycle of change.
What an amazing writeup, great perspective!
Hey jet
Thank you
you are very kind.
Whilst I don’t disagree I would argue that it can be very useful because there are more moving parts to the equation. If it means someone can lose a load of weight to stave off diabetes and buy more time to build a healthier lifestyle then that’s arguably a good thing, as an example. Medicine is ultimately about buying time, after all.
In my family’s case it meant we were not only able to have a child but to do so without IVF. My wife has indeed regained a load of weight but my daughter wouldn’t exist without it.
An incremental step seems helpful from where I’m standing. What we’ve tried so far to deal with our collective weight problem hasn’t worked. Until we figure that out having something that helps buy a lot of people time and quality of life is a bad thing? I strongly disagree.
Hey Flamekebab
Of course there will be instances where any drug will be of benefit to that person.
It is common for women to carry a little weight after birth.
She needs all those extra nutrients to support baby.
I am just very anti big pharma. I have seen far too much damage caused by fantasy drugs, since the introduction of Prozac (Fluoxetine) in the late 1980’s, working in substance misuse and in my practice as a psychotherapist.
For instance, the overprescribing of anti-depressants for the natural human experience of sadness is not OK with me. Sadness, because of death or loss is not clinical depression.
I am an existentialist and strongly believe that all people should take responsibility for their lives.
This also includes not relying on any medication to lose weight, which ultimately is avoiding the main issue at hand.
best of luck with young new addition to the world
I’m a bit more of a realist. If a solution has been given a fair attempt and doesn’t work then it’s not a solution:
This also includes not relying on any medication to lose weight, which ultimately is avoiding the main issue at hand.
This doesn’t achieve the goal. Effectively this boils down to “treat weight gain as a moral failing”. Let’s assume it is (I don’t think it is, but let’s just assume it is for the sake of this line of argument) then why haven’t we already solved it? The problem persists and is more prevalent than ever.
Taking that approach does not achieve the desired results.
Much like choosing not to look both ways before crossing a one-way street, being in the right doesn’t matter if the end result is the same.
I am an existentialist and strongly believe that all people should take responsibility for their lives.
The deck is stacked and people are playing the hands they’re dealt. Vast resources have been poured into fucking with people both chemically and psychologically to form poor eating habits, addictions, and limit economic choices. Personal responsibility is of course important but things are a smidge more complex than that.
It is common for women to carry a little weight after birth.
Just had to comment on this bit because of how hilariously awkward it is. My wife’s a fat lass. It’s not a secret. She finds it hilarious how uncomfortable people are about it. She wants to lose some weight for her long term health, not for aesthetic reasons. Last year she lost 36 kg, averaging about a kilo a week. Before that she tried various things but her body would essentially spend all day screaming at her that she was starving so it took a tremendous psychological toll whilst resulting in barely any loss in weight.
Using your line of argument (and removing the moral failing side) perhaps my wife lacks the personal responsibility to lose weight effectively.
Okay. So then what?
Are we to simply accept that a shortened life expectency and infertility are inevitable?
That doesn’t seem a good way to get a population healthier.
Using your line of argument (and removing the moral failing side) perhaps my wife lacks the personal responsibility to lose weight effectively.
Okay. So then what?
Are we to simply accept that a shortened life expectency and infertility are inevitable?
That doesn’t seem a good way to
Obesity is not a moral failing, it is a lifetime of incorrect dietary advice and encouragement.
Low carbohydrate, ketogenic, diets have all of the benefits of GLP-1 drugs without any of the downsides. TLDR: The big problem with obesity in the world today, and diabetes, is people’s immense carbohydrate intake, coupled with processed food. These two things alone account for metabolic dysfunction in the population.
What that means for real people, is they can join a health program like virta health if they need support, change their diet slowly to be lower carbohydrate, monitor their biometrics, have support groups to talk to to change their habits, see and celebrate the results they get from a new eating pattern
Food is actually more powerful than medicine. We have to be deliberate about the food we take on.
Literally the first line of my comment that you quoted is me stating that it’s not a moral failing. I feel like I couldn’t have been any clearer on that front.
I’m sorry, but it just irks me and makes me immediately unnecessarily hostile.
Anyway, trying to simmer down a bit…
I would absolutely agree that better nutrition is key. However the kinds of systemic and personal change needed will take decades to have an impact on a societal level.
Long term solutions are crucial but having things that work in the short and medium term to pave the way make it a lot easier to reach the long term solutions.
Taking my own example, let’s say such a programme were to work for my wife - how long would that take? Would it be fast enough to beat menopause? She’s 38 now and this solution improved her quality of life dramatically and is helping us not repeat the mistakes of her parents with our own child.
We’re not looking for a quick fix, but a leg up. If we can improve people’s perceptions of themselves it’s a lot easier to get buy in for further lifestyle improvements. If one is already dramatically overweight it’s much easier to be defeatist!
Sorry, didn’t mean any offense.
having things that work in the short and medium term to pave the way make it a lot easier to reach the long term solutions.
Ketogenic eating works today, right now, for individuals
let’s say such a programme were to work for my wife - how long would that take? Would it be fast enough to beat menopause? She’s 38 now and this solution improved her quality of life dramatically and is helping us not repeat the mistakes of her parents with our own child.
Depends how strict they can be, 1 to 2 kg per month is normal, women tend to hit a plateau earlier on ketogenic eating, where their body goes through a period of recomposition where the weight doesn’t reduce, but the fat is still being burned. So it’s important to evaluate these interventions not just by overall weight, but waistline, or body composition scanners if you have access to one
We’re not looking for a quick fix, but a leg up. If we can improve people’s perceptions of themselves it’s a lot easier to get buy in for further lifestyle improvements. If one is already dramatically overweight it’s much easier to be defeatist!
Completely agree. The important thing is to provide people an optimistic path. I’m a big fan of programs like virta because they provide lots of different modalities to meet people where they get the most motivation and feedback to stay on track.
I have looked at a few studies, and ketogenic diets outperform the GLP-1 drugs in total weight loss, and in muscle retention in every study I’ve looked at.
And thank you for supporting my point of view and experiences.
I’m with you on the keto diet.
I am not overweight, never have been, and have been on the Keto Diet for the past 20 years.
My cholesterol level is below normal, yet 70% of my 1500 daily calories come from quality fats; butter, cheese, double cream, lard, avacado oil, olive oil, home made mayonnaise, fats, fats, fats.
Our brains love fat, our brains are made of 80% fat.
I dont eat anthing that grows under the ground. I dont eat anything that has been near a factory.
But isnt fat bad for us? Absolutelty not! We have been lied to by successive governments and the food industry lobbyists and shills.
Look at breakfast cereals, especially the ones advertised at children, with the little toys inside the box, all covered in sugar and sweetness. Biscuits, crisps, tinned sauces, canned drinks, diet drinks. Who in their right mind eats and drinks that shite, its fucking disgusting! None of it is natural.
I came to the conclusion that those poeples, living in the northern hemisphere, naturally live on a keto diet. There are no potato’s, carrots, fruit berries are seasonal. but there is plenty of meat and fat.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I came to the Keto diet when I worked with a client who had terminal cancer. she died after six months. I didnt know anything about cancer, so being a committed therapist, I did my homework and read lots of research.
what astonished me was that cancer lives and feeds on sugars. No sugars, no cancers.
I have seen cancers increase in my lifetime, So we must ask what has changed in the human experience in the past 50-100 years.
It is food, It is our diet. An excess of carbohydrates, carbohydates are a sugars, carbohydrates equal obesity.
Fast food shite shops on every high street, selling shite food: crackdonalds, Burgerkin, piss-on-a-pizza, ken-fucky-fucked-a-chicken, costa-a-fortune coffee, sub-standard-way.
I dont eat take away food of any kind. I love traditional Indian curry’s, but only eat them when they are home cooked by an Indian, Sikh or Hindu it doesnt matter.
The sauces you get in an indian curry from a take away comes from a 25KG barrel. the same sauce goes in every curry they sell. Proper healthy shite.
I asked my mum before she died, did she see many obese people before and after WW2, she said no-one was overweight, she also told me that during the war, The government promoted and told families to feed fat and fats to their children.
Even my nan had a large bowl of dripping in her fridge, Dripping on toast.
For me, the keto diet is a cure all for; obesity, diabetes, Epilepsy, to name a few.
Doctors have started to recommend the ketogenic diet for children with epilepsy, diabetes and obesity with astounding results.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There is a great TV documentary called “The Magic Pill” which is still available on youtube.
here is link to it. sorry I dont do youtube;
https://peteevans.com/videos/the-magic-pill/
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6035294/
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A random selection of research, is amazing.
The impact of a ketogenic diet on weight loss, metabolism, body composition and quality of life
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2589004224025161
Effect of weight-maintaining ketogenic diet on glycemic control and insulin sensitivity in obese T2D subjects
https://drc.bmj.com/content/12/5/e004199
Drug resistant epilepsy and ketogenic diet: A narrative review of mechanisms of action
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2590139724000590
